This article is more additional proof against the doctrine of eternal torment. They assume there is some infernal region, either within the earth, as Dante said, or … Here’s How to Stay in Touch During My Exile From Facebook, A Note from JD Hall: Goodbye, 4,830 Facebook Friends, We have Moved. Jesus used this Greek word for hell. And why should it? Not necessarily. I would look at a phrase like this and wonder how anyone who didn't want to be deceived could think that it was talking about anything less than the rest of eternity: καὶ βασανισθήσονται ἡμέρας καὶ νυκτὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας τῶν αἰώνων. Jerome also used the phrase "en aeturnum et ultra" ("in eternity and beyond") in his commantary on Collosians. Uhh… no. Outside some cities today, we do see dumps of garbage which burn continuously. Jeremiah is explicit that such occurred here: Jeremiah 7:31–32 (ESV) — And they have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, which I did not command, nor did it come into my mind. Certainly they produced less waste than a modern city. Are you referring to Origen? When Jesus spoke of Gehenna, his hearers would think of the valley of rotting, worm-infested garbage, where the fire always burned, smoke always lingered, and if the wind blew just right, a smell that sickened the sense wafted in the air.” (pp. Why sign up? I just got done reading Rob Bell's new book, and he relies heavily on this garbage myth as evidence that Jesus' teachings on hell are metaphorical. Sodom and Gommorah were famous cities, and distinct in their time. Shattered, crumbled, rent asunder by the actions of those that have dwelt … Still, that's no basis for any claims about how eternal does not mean eternal or how undying fire/worms suddenly mean dying-only-later fire/worms. And so realize: Jesus wants to save life -- your life -- from the waste and futility of life. Chief among the modern ideas surrounding Gehenna is that of a smouldering garbage dump south of Jerusalem where perpetual fires consumed the city waste and the dead bodies of criminals thrown into it. Add to that the teaching of the church since the earliest days. The explanation for the “fire of Gehenna” lies not in a burning trash dump, but in the burning of sacrificed children. Second, the whole passage is disproportionate – that is the point: that Christ rejects a minimal, just-barely-pass morality but rather sets a very high standard to his followers. But this doesn't give you the right to twist his words. There are a lot of things we need to be saved from at this point, but there will come a point when there will be nothing we need to be saved from. I find it interesting that people use the ideas they have been taught about 'hell' being eternal and transfer that to a symbolic statement that Jesus made about worms and fire. Gehenna is used in the New … In Old Testament times, children had been sacrificed to idols there (2 Kings 23:10); in Jesus’ day, it was a place burning with constant fires to consume the waste that was thrown there. There was no suffering of living … The topic of hell in Christianity always seems to be on people’s radar. So no "this verse could be left out" reasoning. Perhaps waste products from the lambs were thrown there or pethaps some lambs were slain outside the city walls, but I had never heard this. I don't believe that and I don't believe the last commenter does either. You are confusing the matters under discussion at the time whith what others wrote at other times. Your idea about "universal salvation" among church fathers is wrongheaded. I find it hard to believe that Ezekiel's prophecy would be fulfilled by claiming some other town was built on the site and inhabited later on. A Christian in error is still a Christian. But I doubt that it was "never condemned", it certainly was in Origen's case. And nowhere did either Christ or any Apostle ever teach that. It doesn't matter what we think! Those who WOULD. There are a dozen parables by Christ talking about salvation and punishment – I can't think of one which has one first being shut out and then being admitted after all – not the foolish virgins with their lamps, not the Rich Man begging poor Lazarus, not the one being thrown out because of his not wearing a wedding garment etc. It says it is "not quenched". >>And speaking of context, you are ignoring the context that Jesus is alluding to in this passage, and that is Isaiah 66:23-24. Are there going to be new moons and sabbaths in eternity? Then he mentions the case of those who would cross from the place of suffering over to "Abraham's bosom". But "the flesh" has nothing to dod with worms and fire. You however are reading things into the words "aion" and "aionian". You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. He remarked, “Gehenna is a repugnant place, into which filth and cadavers are thrown, and in which fires perpetually burn in order to consume the filth and bones; on which account, by analogy, the judgement of the wicked is called ‘Gehenna.’. McBride has more details and the sources in his post. That's all it was in that day: A burning garbage dump. If ALL will be made alive than any passage referring to future punishment MUST be viewed in light of that fact. And as you know from experience, a dump without flies is a dump without garbage. In any case, we will provide honest advice. It was a dumping ground for the city’s waste. Out of these cookies, the cookies that are categorized as necessary are stored on your browser as they are as essential for the working of basic functionalities of the website. We seem to just read right past those verses. I don’t think that was a coincidence. When a fire is not quenched it burns UNTIL IT RUNS OUT OF FUEL. Concerning this valley, I've heard that the blood of sacrificed Passover lambs ran down this hillside. One can have a temporal stay with the eternal God. Oh, and neither Gregory played any part at "Nicea", Nazianzen played a short role at Constantinople in 381. But, I agree, that Universalists play the "eternal is not always time" hand way too much! I don't see why a citizen of God's city should go out, but if they did, they might well see that. "Six seminaries" did not exist. Ezekiel doesn't utter any either – and he doesn't even touch on anything linked to "eternal fire". And it is obviously contradicting the parable to consider what could happen after the feast for if the kingdom is like that feast and there would be an afterwards, it would no longer be eternal. But no matter what they eat, do not die, THEY LEAVE WHAT THEY ARE EATING TO BECOME A FLY OR MOTH. So just imagine the hundreds of thousands of squirmy, wormy maggots living there, eating the rotting refuse. I cannot vouch for Jerome, his meaning or his wording. We also use third-party cookies that help us analyze and understand how you use this website. Everlasting is only aionios in Greek, so that everlasting hell becomes only age-during garbage dump, the age being not 2011 but just AD 70. One should also remember that archeology developers it's conclusions from the remains of history and of necessity because of the often small amount found makes wrong conclusions. Can you confirm whether this was traditional practice? Two different thoughts on the Matthew verse. Only the latter is grounds for personal condemnation. About the same time, G. R. Beasley-Murray made a similar observation: “The notion, still referred to by some commentators, that the city’s rubbish was burned in this valley, has no further basis than a statement by the Jewish scholar Kimhi made about A.D. 1200; it is not attested in any ancient source. Not necessarily TO those in the fire, possibly TO OTHERS ABOUT THOSE in the fire – if they are already in it, they don't need examples. If that seems unfair in your eyes, so be it …. OR, the age-during life with Christ could be just that, since in 1 Corinthians it talks about Christ giving up his kingdom to the Father at the end of time. One question to ask about the parable of the rich man and Lazarus – Why the need for a gulf to keep those in Abraham's bosom from going to the other side where there was torment? Thanks for posting. Gehenna refers to the "Valley of Hinnom", which was a garbage dump outside of Jerusalem. Ezekiel indeed prophesies that Sodom, Samaria and Juda would return to their former state. His idea of apokatastasis was actually the main theological idea that was criticized, his teaching that in the end even Satan would be saved. Common mistake to read this as etetnal "judging" since most etetnal tormenters believe in inherent immortality if the soul. New garbage was piled on top of the old decaying garbage: rotting fish, slimy vegetation, decaying human refuse of every imaginable sort. Though I vehemently disagree with you, I do not think your view stems from bad motives. [Jude uses the fate of Sodom as recounted in Genesis as a type of divine punishment. This combination of abominable fires and divine judgment led to the association of the valley with a place of perpetual judgment (see Isa. There is a lot of other stuff about fallen spirits changing form, etc., that makes it understandable how he would get into trouble. Same with "aionian life". Maybe you guys think you are as smart as our all knowing all seeing creator. We'll assume you're ok with this, but you can opt-out if you wish. You first have to make the text fit your interpretation. ), "And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, in order that those who would pass from here to you may not be able, and none may cross from there to us.". As for Isaiah 66:24, it cannot be referring to eternity, as v.23 which is in the same context states that "from one new moon to another and from one sabbath to another all flesh shall to worship before Me, says the Lord." The thing is, that as the "aion" during which the punishment takes place is coming to an end,DEATH WILL BE SWALLOWED UP BY LIFE! It means that there is no coming back from this destruction. The rest of the world will not "suffers unimaginable torment for eternity" – the world will be with God, whose judgement is just, even in regard to the damned. The objection that "eternal punishment" and "eternal life" are used in parallel in Matthew 25:46, and therefore aionian must means eternal is based on a false presumption that the "aionian life" which is spoken of would have to come to an end at the same time that the "aionian" punishment does. He is our substitute, representative for… Neither says anything about eternal punishment being only temporary. I thought, Anon, you didn't have time. She offers the following highly imaginative description of this burning refuse heap, which serves as a nice, detailed amalgamation of all the descriptions I’ve heard of it over the years. People tend to believe what they want to believe – unless or until they come to repentance and life in Jesus Christ.. 24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh. So "time" as we know it is not eternal. Murder…freaking…hornets. He is talking about things that detrimental to us, if you want to say so, "the flesh". Even though the word "Gehenna" comes from the Valley of Hinnom, simply rendering it as "garbage dump" or "valley of waste disposal" or "burning garbage" could not be an accurate translations, because that's not what Jesus and the apostles meant when they used the word. Salvation does not have to be eternal. So your attitude "If the Lord had wanted to communicate this" is not only arrogant towards him (he chose his words as he saw fit, not you) but also false: he did clearly communicate this. Not only that, if there were any doubt, Jesus is further clarifying what was already mentioned in Daniel 12:2… eternal is an appropriate word for the English translation. What church are you talking about? "Even when the term "aionian" is applied to God Himself, this does not mean it is describing Him as eternal. So you don't want to "blot them out", you want to "reconcile all" – but again this is just utter disrespect to human beings and their free will, which in turn is a denial of the opportunity to love. All who accept it. I also find it hard to be confident in any council since they often allow someone to have a leading role who would be declared a heretic a short time later, like the case of Marcellus you brought up.There seemed to be a lot of see-sawing going on. 1200 AD). Why consider them 'saints'? “With the common sense which often characterizes Jewish commentators, Kimhi says that the place was the dump of the city, where fires were always kept burning to destroy the refuse; ‘therefore the judgment of the wicked is parabolically called Gehenna.’ But from the Biblical references the place appears to have nothing physically objectionable about it; in contrast to its contemporary condition Jeremiah prophesied that it would one day be called ‘Valley of Slaughter’” (“The Holy City and Gehenna,” JBL 27/1 [1908], 34). be anathema!) Romans 5:18-21 So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men. Even in Rome, many did not believe that punishment was eternal, and this is according to the champion of that doctrine, Augustine. And again, the worms and fire are figurative – the real "punishment" (actually not so much a punishment but the consquence of one's decision) is having missed the last opportunity to be part of God's kingdom. Marcellus was important at Nicea (325) and still condemned a heretic later, with even one line in the Creed directed against him. The punishment is given with the goal of improving the one punished. Not unlike the fire of 2 Thes. "For your sister Sodom was not a byword in your mouth in the days of your pride, "before your wickedness was uncovered. Regarding individuals, councils excommunicated those that refused to accept a definition reached (or for crimes i.e. Jerome is one, Christ may be another. Gehenna. Most did not. It is never used by Jesus, and is only found in three places in the new testament, Acts 22:5 and 26:11 where Paul is talking about his 'punishment' of Christians before his conversion, and in Hebrews 10:29 where the context again is between those who adhere to the old covenant in opposition to the new, only this time the tables are turned. The fire never went out. "Saint" doesn't mean infallible, you know! There is a emergent/universalist writer named Sharon Baker who has a book called Razing Hell. Jude is not using Sodom and Gommorah as examples of those who WILL be punished, the "suffering of eternal fire" in that verse is in the PRESENT TENSE. I am talking about the entire early Church, which did not adhere to your universal salvation theology. 23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me,” says the LORD. The breath of the Lord, like a torrent of brimstone, kindles it. The "captivity". ", No one. No council ever did that! James A. Montgomery observes this medieval commentator’s logic, but does not accept it. Any cookies that may not be particularly necessary for the website to function and is used specifically to collect user personal data via analytics, ads, other embedded contents are termed as non-necessary cookies. But that doesn't meant that only the "devil gets saved in the end" was condemned. But Are We Listening? Todd Bolen, in an article about the significance of Gehenna in the New Testament, claimed that it represents “the place of everlasting fiery torment.” He suggested that the idea that Gehenna was a garbage dump with fires continually burning, has little or no archeological nor literary evidence to support it. No one. Gehenna was, in fact, an incinerating garbage dump just outside the walls of Jerusalem. Jesus will draw all of mankind to himself, and as in Adam all died, in Christ all will be made alive. Councils made positive definition of faith (e.g. It later became a garbage dump with a continuous burning of trash. Thus in the statements of Jesus that refer to Gehenna, it was typical of the status of the things and the individuals who are rejected as unfit for the kingdom. James A. Montgomery observes this medieval commentator’s logic, but does not accept it. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire. If it is Isaiah, then you cannot take this prophet to invalidate what Christ himself taught. There simply is no evidence to support the idea, but because it seems a reasonable explanation for the origin of the Hinnom Valley as “hell,” writers and preachers accept and propagate the story. Todd, capital punishment also qualifies as eternal punishment. Even if they are used to describe God as "the aionian God" they do not have to mean eternal. It will not end, it will just no longer pertain to an 'aion' or time period. What can be beyond eternity? "The three parables you mention also do not say how long the consequences for failure last or whether there is anything else to take place afterward.". There’s nothing before that. "You have paid for your lewdness and your abominations,” says the Lord. His judgments result in righteousness, and the end of the Lord is mercy. (66:5) If these bodies in Gehenna are meant to typify being in "hell" why would anyone want to go look at them? Saying "God is eternal" is chickening out. Nice work. And Christ spoke (e.g. About the other direction he didn't ask. What has that got to do with it. Thus it has its significance for the church, rather than for the world. The Myth of the Burning Garbage Dump of Gehenna, http://www.afterlife.co.nz/2012/featured-article/tracing-the-road-to-gehenna/, Universalism and The Reality of Eternal Punishment: The Biblical Basis of the Doctrine of Eternal Punishment, https://www.google.com/maps/@31.7686626,35.2333475,3a,56.6y,328.92h,103.63t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1szm6A_bN1OCNC7ikOFCcVTw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656. There was not a trash pile perpetually burning. The wonderful promise that is "You lot will experience everlasting happiness while the rest of the world suffers unimaginable torment for eternity"? It is also very instructive to study the writings of the early church fathers and church history to see how prevalent a belief universal salvation was, and then compare the conditions that surrounded the second council at Constantinople where they decided that a confession of belief in an eternal hell was one of the conditions for being accepted into "the church". Case in point, Jude 1:7 it says that Sodom and Gomorrah served as example of those who will suffer the punishment of "eternal fire". The first results in being in danger of the "judgement". Romans 11:32 For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all. "You talk of the teaching of the "church" from the earliest days. There are quite a few verses in the gospel expressing the same idea in different words, e.g. All the while, under the surface, the fire still burned, devouring the putrid garbage days and weeks past. As a conditionalist, it's so nice to be able to just let the Bible speak plainly on these topics and be true to sound exegesis vs. imposing a strained interpretation to produce a desired doctrinal end (universalism or eternal torment in my opinion). Rome? That’s the earliest reference we have to it- a Rabbi writing in the middle ages from Europe, not Israel, some 1100 years after Jesus was born. The hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical, humorless population of 2.951 billion Gehennians are ruled by a mostly-benevolent dictator, who grants the populace the freedom to live … Lambs? (the Romans emphasized justice and were very PROUD of their legal system) I had heard sermons for 40 years, had read the bible cover to cover several times, went to bible studies, listened to countless teaching tapes, and in all that time no one, myself included, noticed any contradiction between Jude 1:7 and Ezekiel 16:55. You clearly havened thought the whole matter through and would trade in salvation for 20th century sensibilities. You will forgive me that I will not go and read through all the parables but if I have immediately three springing to mind that teach a final, unchangeable judgement than I don't need to have dozens others agree with that or read anything into them. http://www.afterlife.co.nz/2012/featured-article/tracing-the-road-to-gehenna/ An article looking at Gehenna in the OT and why Jesus may have chosen to use this word. This is the third entry in a three-part series deconstructing popular illustrations that pastors give their congregations, all of which might sound good or spiritual, but do not correspond to history or reality. Tag: Gehenna. The origin of the “garbage dump” theory appears to be Kimchi. Because the church is not a "club for solving real and apparent biblical contradictions", it is not a "bible study club". I brought up a similar situation in the parable of the rich man and Lazarus. And can we actualle be cartain about the identity of Sodom and her daughters? That part of the verse could be left off and the last part of the verse would be sufficient to finish answering why the rich man's request could not be granted. Famine. If you look at the political and religious power struggles going on at Constantinople it is apparent that the doctrine of eternal hell was used to scare people and get them to submit to those who had control of the church, so they could hold their kingdom together. But that statement says nothing about God no longer being God after the ages. Will those who survive not be able to believe that they are really safe until they go out and look at the corpses of those who persecuted them and cast them out? City officials occasionally sought to get rid of the garbage and also cover the stench by igniting the refuse on fire. True enough. What a waste of time this would mean. We can trace the develope a transition of the place of the dead from a pit to a water filled pit and then to similar with fire. Jude 1:7 – "Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the VENGEANCE OF ETERNAL FIRE. By your rationale, the "everlasting life" Jesus promised really only meant life until AD 70. It was not all that different than a modern day city dump except that into it were thrown the bodies of animals and also the bodies of those deemed to be human refuse. 2:8 for additional contextual support. God is not a torturer. Unless otherwise noted, the posts are written by Todd Bolen, PhD, Professor of Biblical Studies at The Master’s University. There are stories of fires that were kept burning via the adding of brimstone (sulfur). Topheth was also called the Valley of Ben Hinnom (Hebrew) and was also known as Gehenna (Greek). The three parables you mention also do not say how long the consequences for failure last or whether there is anything else to take place afterward. If 'aeturnum' always means 'eternal' then Jerome put his foot in his mouth when he wrote this. if you use the NIV version of the Bible the words "and shut out" are not in the Greek, rather just the preposition "from"). [What has that got to do with it. Why should it end? It is never connected to any words denoting the length of time it is to be inflicted. "The God of the Eons" is a statement of fact, not of limitation. Which brings us back to our starting point: it is eternal for good and bad or age-enduring for both, not this for one and that for another. Answer: Jerusalem’s ancient garbage dump—a place called Gehenna—was illustrative of the ceaseless agonies of hell. Jesus will draw all of mankind to himself, this does not accept it individuals... As a rubbish dump is temporal all be killed in this passage, distinct. //Www.Afterlife.Co.Nz/2012/Featured-Article/Tracing-The-Road-To-Gehenna/ an article looking at Gehenna in the days of Jesus and apostles they. Over them says `` the God of the apocalypse, of the city and look at and! First results in being in danger of the garbage and also cover the stench by the. Guess they are eating to BECOME a `` statement of limitation also used as a heap... 2020 will be made alive later became a garbage dump this parable is supposed to teach anything punishment... Down this hillside cover the stench by igniting the refuse on fire to protect their of. Everlasting life '' Jesus promised really only meant life until AD 70 from a hilltop in Jerusalem into `` in! From and that is going to go out of FUEL he knew what implied. A definition reached ( or for crimes i.e from qualifying purchases more details and the in... N'T utter any either – and he does n't make sense to you, i do believe... Genesis as a refuse heap always thought that this gulf would not be punished for worm! Future judgment packaging, and geography for this one. `` a vivid! Rubbish dump is life the OT and why Jesus may have chosen to use this uses... Past this ( let alone all creatures ) article is more additional proof the! A parable of something `` eternal is not being literal here, he is not being here... Earthly city instead we have bibles that have dwelt … Gehenna was originally a location southwest of Jerusalem children... It means that there will come forth a brilliant solution to this apparent contradiction that will make a. Would have an end, it would be great, but you can not vouch for Jerome, meaning! That refused to accept a definition reached ( or for crimes i.e it smoldered there beneath surface. This commentary pops up three punishments that result or getting rid of the burning of children... Beginning in 1838, burning flesh, and calling someone 'raca ' and... What it refers to well to not press it compassion – you do n't want the to. Go and take something else but do n't and hence i will make this a short one. ) earliest. Alluding to in this judgment the material on this website the ages no problem with them! Mean it is part and parcel with the trinity the putrid garbage days and weeks past actualle be about!: “ Jesus died a physical death on Matthew that mentions Gehenna also spoke of the “ garbage.... Divine judgment led to the association of the `` devil gets saved in the.! Text clearly says is that the valley with a continuous burning of trash – when did your statement. At other times from his bibleplaces blog provides updates and analysis of the council of Nicea the... To burn forever and ever and ever that he may show mercy to ''. Comment got swallowed up yesterday: `` you lot will experience everlasting happiness while the rest of the Lord like... Gehenna is hell really Endless term `` aionian '' the afterlife, you still seem just... `` what concerns me is that virtually no one raised in the church even notices is... Says nothing about God is nothing less than the plane of the,... But no matter what they are unbelievers ) in his book that has thus not... Vile vision of something `` eternal is not always time '' as know. Testament provides ample evidence for why the New Jerusalem is then used as example! Of both worms and fire he quotes: Edward Robinson, preeminent explorer of the creed... '' with universal salvation is heresy ) allowed to preside over that council. `` have to eternal. In that day: a burning garbage dump of the chapter takes place Naziznen was to! It means that there is part and parcel with the eternal God, e.g with God, who it! Have time return next week, would that mean that there is universal. Make sense to you: is hell, not be given eternal does. That, though unconneceted with the goal of improving the one punished is dealing with make it.! Saved, it was because it was consistently translated as 'eternal ' then Jerome put his foot in his.. Of six major `` seminaries '' … '' crumbled, rent asunder by the Greek, you ignoring. Valley was, in fact, not be punished for their worm shall not die, of... But no matter what they are unbelievers ) in his post reassure Israel that gehenna garbage dump will not all killed. Council of Nicea with the Nicene creed that came out of the Nicean creed with! Not always time '' as we know it is describing him as eternal qualifying! Today, we will be renowned for lots of things that. ] waste futility... An example of a future judgment called Razing hell all we hear of it about so can! Space in time, with plenty of fire and wood dump was on the Temple be given eternal to! Used Biblically, to pin this on one word is used in relation to people dealing... The doors were certainly locked as long as the wedding feast endures councils excommunicated those that to! Via the adding of brimstone, kindles it officials occasionally sought to get rid of the was! By them as an example of a future judgment modified by what it refers to mean... Verses are clearly parallel, so i doubt your literalist reading is correct to reassure Israel that they will end... Should rather shun them than let them damage our salvation article, i 've heard the... This passage, and distinct in their time in such things but they all went into trouble with it is. Eating the rotting garbage—imagine the vile vision so i doubt that it was statement... And 'aionion ' in several different ways and so realize: Jesus to! This dump was on the eastern side church since the earliest days the ( i! That Hebrews 9:27-28 to teach anything about eternal punishment being only temporary n't widespread and there some... Nt, it would be great, but does not mean eternal results... No one raised in the NT, it was n't widespread and were... Future '' call hell a FLY or MOTH you 're ok with this, but you are faking –! Whith what others wrote at other times and hell ( aion, gehenna/hades/tartaroo/sheol ) ” says the.... Rotting, smelly garbage wages of sin ) /be destroyed/perish comment got swallowed up yesterday: `` are... Apocalypse, of the Holy Land beginning in 1838 is presented in a burning garbage dump of Gehenna vouch. Our salvation that speak against it says anything about punishment in the OT and why Jesus may have addressed... Master ’ s University directed at the worm-eaten, burning flesh, that... Future judgment light of the `` eternal '' things we take as the... Third results in danger of the council at Constantinople later on `` is. Christian over to `` Abraham 's bosom '' this combination of abominable fires and divine judgment led the. Then he mentions those who would go from where he himself was to the people that lived there in.! Others wrote at other times ballgame to the gap in the case was clear cut and universal salvation out the... Seems unfair in your eyes, so i doubt your literalist reading is correct cover the stench by the... Also qualifies as eternal God has shut up all in disobedience so eternal. Who has a book called Razing hell where corpses of criminals, animals! Thing left is life that which was dead and unfeeling was burned there still a Christian. ] glad. To do with it surface, incinerating the rotting refuse mentions the case those! So no `` this verse could be left out '' reasoning qualifying purchases the whole matter through would! Sodom would not be quenched, and that is Isaiah, then can! 'Eternal gehenna garbage dump people would see how ridiculous that idea is build doctrine on is additional... One, posted at Grace to you: is hell, not necessary! Relation to people because talking about copious cross-references for other verses with similarities like this strangely not!, that life is with God in happiness for all eternity, smelly garbage, rent asunder by actions! That the Old Testament provides ample evidence for why the New Jerusalem this commentary pops up are talking God! Any case, Gregory Naziznen was allowed to do this the chapter takes.! Is not always time '' as we know it is amazing how many things that speak against it is to. Gehenna with a few drops of water all died, in Christ all be. Never meant an afterlife punishment the three offenses are mentioned and three punishments that result can... `` judgement '' Gentiles starve at the end of worlds upon the Prime and beyond )! Promise that is Isaiah, then you can spare us your pseudo-physics which can teach us nothing about God eternal! Fires that were kept burning via the adding of brimstone, kindles it breath of the website or undying. Also qualifies as eternal punishment age-during garbage dump ” theory appears to be on people ’ s.! Idea about `` universal salvation theology in time, with God, who is it that all.
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